“I spoke a lot as president about wanting an inclusive, open Ireland that cherished not only those who are living in Ireland, but all of those who had to leave Ireland,” President Robinson told Ms.
When Mary Robinson made history as Ireland’s first woman president, she declared, “I was elected by the women of Ireland, who, instead of rocking the cradle, rocked the system.” This quote encapsulates a woman who was set on disrupting the system to pursue fair representation.
Robinson, the daughter of medical doctors and the only sister of four brothers, was born in Ireland. Her captivating political journey led her to become Ireland’s seventh president, marking a significant milestone as the first woman to assume the office. She pursued law at Trinity College Dublin, where, notably, she stood as one of three women in her class. A fellowship then took her to Harvard Law School, which only enriched her already storied career.
As a senator and historic president, Robinson championed pivotal causes, working to decriminalize homosexuality, legalize contraception and divorce, and encourage women’s participation on juries. Regarded as a “conscious leader” by those close to her, Robinson extended her advocacy to climate justice, human rights and peacebuilding. Following her presidency, she served as the high commissioner for human rights at the United Nations, creating the organization’s human rights agenda. She is now Chair of The Elders, a group of global leaders established by Nelson Mandela in 2007 to work on justice and human rights.
Ahead of International Women’s Day, RepresentWomen had the esteemed privilege of interviewing Mary Robinson for Ms. In this interview, we explore the depths of her humanitarian work, her political journey, and the heartwarming tradition she initiated with her grandchildren, who hold a special place in her heart.
RepresentWomen: We learned about your beautiful accomplishments, and we want to dig into who you are as a person and get a little bit out of your background, so can you tell us how it grew up and how you got into politics?
Mary Robinson: I got into politics because I spent a year at Harvard Law School. I’m in the class of 1968. So bear in mind that I’m an elder. And that was a wonderful year, ’67 to ’68, when I was doing my masters in law. My American colleagues were resisting the draft and taking part in what they thought was an immoral war against Vietnam. At the same time, many of my friends were also joining civil rights or poverty programs in the South of the United States.
I brought back to Ireland a sense of young people making a difference, which was so completely not what was happening in Ireland at the time. In Ireland, you waited into your 30s and probably your 40s for your turn, and if you were a woman, you didn’t really have any turn particularly.
I was a graduate of Trinity, and I questioned why it was elderly male professors who always got elected. So my friend said, ‘Well, if you’re mad enough, why don’t you stand? We’ll all support you.’ So, I got elected at the age of 25 because of Harvard and because of the influence of what young people can do.
In Ireland, you waited into your 30s and probably your 40s for your turn, and if you were a woman, you didn’t really have any turn particularly.
Mary Robinson
RepresentWomen: What were your aspirations even as a young girl before you got to Harvard? Were you encouraged to do medicine, or what were you motivated to do by your parents when you were younger?
Robinson: I think my childhood influenced me greatly, growing up in the West of Ireland. I was the only girl wedged between four brothers—two older and two younger—so of course, I had to be interested in gender equality, human rights, and using my elbows.
Interestingly, my parents, who were medical doctors, weren’t a political family at all. They told me that I could have the same opportunities as my brothers, but the whole of Irish society was telling me something very different.
You know, girls were very limited. If you were married, you had to retire from the civil service; you couldn’t do this and couldn’t do that. Even my mother didn’t practice but was very active in the town. She looked after my grandfather, who lived also in the same town and had retired from illness. She was very active but didn’t work professionally and she was very fulfilled. I found she was a force of nature in her own way.
RepresentWomen: You’ve made historic moves, such as working to decriminalize homosexuality and legalize divorce—things we’re even dealing with here in the U.S. What was your motivation to ensure these things were done?
Robinson: I decided to become a lawyer to try to bring about social change. I wasn’t interested in making money. I took a lot of cases on issues of equal pay, the right of women to serve on juries, the homosexual issue, which I took to the Court of Human Rights, and so on.
Since then, I’ve so admired the changes that have taken place. I think my presidency did help because I spoke a lot as president about wanting an inclusive, open Ireland that cherished not only those who are living in Ireland, but all of those who had to leave Ireland. I put the famous light in the window for them. I just think we’ve benefited greatly from how young people took those as human rights issues and wouldn’t give up.
I was the only girl wedged between four brothers—two older and two younger—so of course, I had to be interested in gender equality, human rights, and using my elbows.
Robinson
RepresentWomen: What are the greatest challenges and opportunities for electing more women in Ireland? Could you also speak to your perspective on running a single transferable vote (proportional ranked-choice voting) election?
Robinson: After my election as a woman president, followed by Mary McAleese, who served two terms as a woman president, we both felt that women would be much more active and involved in politics. There has been some improvement, but the social media environment in Ireland, like elsewhere, is very tough for young women.
Just the amount of harassment, the personal remarks like “she’s too fat” or “she’s stupid”—all of this wears women down quite a bit. So, it’s not easy for women to think about standing for local or national politics.
There’s no doubt that the single transferable vote system in Ireland helps women because you know it’s a way of making a vote count because, in a way, you can just rank your choice in a ranked-choice ballot. You can vote right down pages 1, 2, and 3, and you can give them all a vote.
Let me give you an example of my own election. It was the one election and, therefore, had three very popular candidates. I was second in the voting, and the third candidate who would have to drop out would transfer his votes to me. So even though I didn’t believe it, a day before the actual final count, people said to me, ‘You know, you’re elected. You’re going to be president.’
I was saying, ‘I’m going to wait for the votes,’ and I won. I couldn’t believe it—but it shows that the system helps people make choices and helps women gain more support.
RepresentWomen: Who’s your favorite author?
Robinson: My favorite author is a hard one because I read quite widely. I suppose that nowadays I’m reading climate books. There’s a book by Catherine Ho called ‘Saving Us.’ Her book teaches how to talk to Trump supporters and is beautifully written.
RepresentWomen: What’s your favorite thing to do with your grandchildren?
Robinson: I told my grandchildren that when they reached 16, they could go with Granny somewhere. I’m on my third grandchild, a 16-year-old who lives in Barcelona with his parents. I brought him to Paris, and we had the best of fun. He loved the Eiffel Tower. He spent three hours up in it while I waited in the cafe.
I now have four other grandchildren, and the youngest is 3. I’m a bit worried about how old I’ll be when she’s 16, but we’ll have to work on that.
RepresentWomen: What advice would you give to your 25-year-old self, especially other 25-year-olds who are really interested in working on human rights and peacebuilding and bringing that gender angle of how women approach these issues differently and why they’re essential in the space?
Robinson: I was thinking more of advice to myself, but it also applies to the broader way you’ve put the question.
I would advise my 25-year-old self to use a lot more humor. In my political life and now, I’ve learned from Archbishop TuTu and others. When women go forward, put themselves forward for election, and get elected, they take it seriously. They become sorta peachy. And it doesn’t actually work too well. Young men, when they get elected, are very relaxed, and they use humor, which is very attractive to people.
So, I often say to a younger woman going forward, use humor because it’s very emotional. You touch people with humor.
As president, I made an address to both houses of our Parliament, which I was passionate about. That speech is often promoted in Ireland, and every time I see it, I cringe at the complete lack of humor, even at the beginning. I just went full-on for the whole speech. It didn’t go down particularly well with the Parliament because they felt it was too political; the president was interfering in their area, and I was preaching to them rather than engaging them with some humor in our common cause.
It applies to human rights, it applies to conflict, it applies to gender equality, it applies to anything.
I even have a podcast called ‘Mothers of Invention,’ paired with comedian Maeve Higgins, who’s based in New York, and the humor is what makes it a very successful podcast.
Humor is a great way to bring people together, both experts and people who don’t know a lot about an issue, and build a bridge and community, especially as we tackle these huge issues.
RepresentWomen: Thank you for answering our questions, and we look forward to working with you in the future.
Robinson: Okay, thank you very much. I’ve been a fan of Ms. magazine for a long time, so I appreciate this interview.
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